Nia Glassie

[Ab]

I have been reluctant to start a thread with this title. The rationalisations for my reluctance were things like "oh well, people have mentioned it in other threads" or "oh well, sucks to be poor and brown" or "oh well, can't start a thread for every Maori kid who dies of child abuse, we'd run out of disk space", or "oh well, I'm busy doing Something More Important, someone else will make a thread I guess".

Of course those rationalisations, and myself, are utterly full of shit.

You know why I was reluctant to start this thread? Because I don't want to think about what happened to her.

So now I'm thinking about it.

[BloodDonor]

yeah, thinking about it surely does make for an otherwise good day, to go down the tubes

[Hazmat]

What really got to me was reading the list of abuse suffered on Stuff.
Any one of the actions by itself IMHO counts as horrendous. The fact the poor girl suffered and survived (for a time) the whole lot shows just how strong the survival instinct can be.

I'm still in disbelief at how sucky people can be....

I hate to say it or even think it but....."sometimes dead is better"

[Luse]

Originally Posted by Ab

Because I don't want to think about what happened to her.

So now I'm thinking about it.

Me too. I find it repulsive that someone could do all those horrible things to a kid. Absolutely disgusting.

[Ab]

Read this.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...0543813&pnum=0

[blynk]

It was shocking. And looking at a couple of those guys, they looked fucked. There some form of child abuse/mother drinking while pregnant when they were young.
Imagine trying to be the lawyer for those guys.

I would say this is where the need the death penalty, but I think I would prefer something like 23hours a day of solitary confinement with the other hour being beaten by guards.

[Juju]

Times like this I wish powers to be would bring in castration and neutering as punishments so people couldn't breed anymore.

[caffiend]

I was reading the Dom Post at lunch-time, and had a strong automatic desire to just skip any story related to this (which was a fair proportion of the front page and at least 2 further pages inside). It took a deliberate act of willpower to read those articles - it's not nice to feel a mix of sadness and rage while trying to relax during a busy day.

But I did read it - and what struck me most was the comment that the presiding judge, when she thanked the jury for the diligence, was crying.

A judge - presumably an experienced judge who's officiated numerous child abuse and other violent crimes cases - cried. While the reporting of the facts of the case have been relatively descriptive, I doubt anyone could say they know fully how much that little girl suffered unles they were closely involved with the case.

Sickening. And I would like to see those cunts burned alive - just out of sheer blind anger.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by caffiend

It took a deliberate act of willpower to read those articles - it's not nice to feel a mix of sadness and rage while trying to relax during a busy day.

I still have yet to finish one.

[Macca@Work]

Its not just poor maori families but for some reason they seem to
attract more publicity.There are plenty of sickoes who are white.
I guess its a self perpetuating issue with different catalysts.
More than likely they were bashed when they were young by
parents who were probably bashed themselves or put through
some extreme stress.There isn't an easy solution or fix.
Maybe hightened public awareness similair to domestic violence
where it is no longer condoned to give the missus the bash
to keep her in line.Maybe better support services for young mums
and dads.

[fixed_truth]

I think to address the cause of this type of thing you need intervention - lots of it, starting from birth. The trouble is that 90% (approx) of people aren't abusing their kids but we need laws for the 10% that are, and a good chunk of those 90% are offended that the state be checking up on them decent folk. Rather these people take the personal responsibility route and think introducing harsher penalties will deter people from choosing to do this shit.
/frustrated rant

[xin]

Does anybody have the crib notes for what happened? I missed the entire thing, despite working for a the herald.

[Mickey]

I started reading the list yesterday but the tears started rolling. I can understand one person doing shit cos they might be fucked in the head and suffer from a mental illness where they can't control their actions.....but I really cant understand this gang mentallity against a little kid.
The mother astounds me, i feel nothing but pure and utter hatred. The dumb and dumber brother duo is so fucked up, what a couple of tough guys picking on a toddler.

I can only hope and pray that those involved get a very long jail sentence and that someone gets them in jail. I hope it hurts and i hope the pain is continuous. I hope they live in fear.

I love that they cried during sentencing, did they seriously think they would get off?

[Ab]

Originally Posted by xin

Does anybody have the crib notes for what happened? I missed the entire thing, despite working for a the herald.

Originally Posted by Ab

Read this.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...0543813&pnum=0

[arkanix]

I keep seeing that smiling photo of her, looking so happy and alive - then I think about what happened to her and I just lose it when I think about anyone harming such an innocent, happy child.
I just don't understand.
How could someone do that? It is truly beyond belief.
I can't read those articles all the way through, vision gets too blurry with tears.

I just hope you're in a better place, Nia.

[sv]

I have no words for this.

[HughMann]

That's fucking rotten. I feel sick to my stomach.

[CCS]

Originally Posted by arkanix

I just don't understand.
How could someone do that?

Near as I can figure, they're just not human.

[Sp0nge]

Originally Posted by Macca@Work

Its not just poor maori families but for some reason they seem to
attract more publicity.There are plenty of sickoes who are white.
I guess its a self perpetuating issue with different catalysts.
More than likely they were bashed when they were young by
parents who were probably bashed themselves or put through
some extreme stress.There isn't an easy solution or fix.
Maybe hightened public awareness similair to domestic violence
where it is no longer condoned to give the missus the bash
to keep her in line.Maybe better support services for young mums
and dads.

QFT
its a complex issue that requires a more intelligent response than "kill the fuckers"

I think part of the solution is to get people to accept that
IT's NOT OK TO USE VIOLENCE
....against kids or anyone...
but judging by the response to the "anti-smacking" bill, its going to be an uphill battle.

hypocrisy ain't going to solve any problems.

[MadMax]

The brothers didn't play sport or work, there was booze and pot, though no suggestion of P.

They didn't have much money so were home a lot and found ways to entertain themselves.

the hand that gives can also take away. those on the benefit should be placed under more control - monthly reports to the winz office ... after a year of no employment: army initiation camp with "work skills training" (read: 8 to 5 regular labour) ... home calls etc.

these guys are going to have a lot of fun in prison if changes like these are made after this case.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Sp0nge

IT's NOT OK TO USE VIOLENCE

I employed violence to open a tin of paint the other day. Was that not OK?

Earlier this year I hit a guy as hard as I could and left him on the ground stunned and unable to breathe. None of the other players or coaching staff seemed to think my tackle was not OK. Was it?

A couple of weeks ago I ran up behind my 3-year-old son and grabbed his arm and pulled it so violently that he was yanked backwards and it brought tears to his eyes. He was about to walk out onto a road in front of a car. Was that not OK?

[Reformed_Quint]

Stop the cycle before it fucking starts, remove these people and others like them from the gene pool, castrations all round.

That bitch has several more kids (5?) do you think they are going to grow up and NOT beat their children, yea fucking right.

[Sp0nge]

Originally Posted by Ab

Was that not OK?

yawn....way to miss the point.

(because the alternative is that you're one of those people who tries to excuse their violence with reasons and semantics
...but I dont think youre that Vietch kind of guy)

violence n. Physical force exerted for the purpose of violating, damaging, or abusing

[Ab]

I'm not trying to excuse anything, I'm trying to point out that useless statements like "it's not OK to use violence" are, well, useless. My examples illustrate that there are instances of violence that are OK -- or at least not "not OK". If I had been standing next to the tumble dryer that these cunts stuck Nia in, and seen them reaching out to turn it on, knowing what I know now I would feel perfectly justified in employing violence to prevent them from doing so. Or would that be "not OK"?

[Sp0nge]

I've been here long enough
for you to realise that my posts can be read at many levels....

you may think that my statement
'its not ok to use violence' is a useless statement

others may see that its actually bringing the Family Violence campaign slogan to this thread.
that slogan, which you may not be aware of in koala land
is that "Violence is not ok"
http://nz.youtube.com/watch?v=poRjb4m8RXk
http://www.areyouok.org.nz/

but go on...I wont interrupt you again, lol

[Russian]

Originally Posted by Ab

I'm not trying to excuse anything, I'm trying to point out that useless statements like "it's not OK to use violence" are, well, useless. My examples illustrate that there are instances of violence that are OK -- or at least not "not OK". If I had been standing next to the tumble dryer that these cunts stuck Nia in, and seen them reaching out to turn it on, knowing what I know now I would feel perfectly justified in employing violence to prevent them from doing so. Or would that be "not OK"?

depends what your definition of violence is, is

[Dan]

Originally Posted by Sp0nge

I've been here long enough
for you to realise that my posts can be read at many levels....

you may think that my statement
'its not ok to use violence' is a useless statement

others may see that its actually bringing the Family Violence campaign slogan to this thread.
that slogan, which you may not be aware of in koala land
is that "Violence is not ok"
http://www.areyouok.org.nz/

but go on...I wont interrupt you again, lol

You've both got legitimate points. As Ab points out (with his somewhat argumentitive examples ), there's more than one sense of 'violence':

1. There's violent actions in the sense of 'Intensity or severity, as in natural phenomena; untamed force: e.g. the violence of a tornado' which we can all agree is acceptable sometimes as a means to a non-abusive end.

2. But there's also the sense of 'violence' which Sp0nge probably intended: 'the exertion of force so as to abuse or violate' which I think we can all agree, is "always not ok", and not a useless statement.

[BillHague]

Originally Posted by Ab

I employed violence to open a tin of paint the other day. Was that not OK?

Earlier this year I hit a guy as hard as I could and left him on the ground stunned and unable to breathe. None of the other players or coaching staff seemed to think my tackle was not OK. Was it?

A couple of weeks ago I ran up behind my 3-year-old son and grabbed his arm and pulled it so violently that he was yanked backwards and it brought tears to his eyes. He was about to walk out onto a road in front of a car. Was that not OK?

Even if it wasn't entirely explicit, I would have thought that anyone with the proper number of chromosomes could infer what he actually meant.

Which leaves me asking, why did you bother writing this?

[Sp0nge]

Originally Posted by Dan

As Ab points out (with his somewhat argumentitive examples ), there's more than one sense of 'violence':

yeah, but its pretty obvious on this thread that I am talking about Family Violence.
so the tin can/rugby examples are a bit lolz

I wonder if anyone has gone to the areyouok website and commented there
"actually, it is ok to yank your kids arm to save their life...kthanksbye"

Originally Posted by Sp0nge

but go on...I wont interrupt you again, lol

I just realised...i wasnt interrupting Ab in the first place

[Ab]

Again, if I had been able to prevent Nia's murderers from turning on the tumble dryer by using violence to intimidate and inflict injury, I should have refrained from doing so? Because such violence is never OK. "Never" is pretty unequivocal.

[ChaosWulf]

Originally Posted by Ab

Because I don't want to think about what happened to her.

I still can't. Not without raging, crying or cursing mankind. So I don't. I hope that there will be some justice, I hope she is in a better place, and I hope that these cycles of violence can stop some day so this never happens again.

All this "hoping" feels pretty fucking redundant, I must say

[Biff]

Bring back the stockade, I'll bring some bricks to chuck at the fuckers.

[_Incubus_]

Its times like this I wish more people support the death penalty.

[funnel web]

It's times like these that I give my daughter a hug and tell her I love her. Ok, I do that every day but more so today.

[[WanG] Wandarah]

It's just fucking bizarre really isnt it. I remember seeing this on the news when I was home last year - I had all these fantastic notions of coming home to wonderful New Zealand, from crime-ridden, dark and miserable London.

Then I turn on the TV and see some shit about some backwards ass freaks sticking a kid in a drier.

*shatter*

[A Corpse]

Originally Posted by arkanix

I keep seeing that smiling photo of her, looking so happy and alive - then I think about what happened to her and I just lose it when I think about anyone harming such an innocent, happy child.
I just don't understand.
How could someone do that? It is truly beyond belief.
I can't read those articles all the way through, vision gets too blurry with tears.

I just hope you're in a better place, Nia.

That photo is often shown when there's an item about her on the news or in the paper. Sitting there in a carseat, big broad smile. It reminds me so much of my nearly-1 year old daughter. She's got that same huge smile. This happened before she was born. I remember hearing about it then and wondering how or why, but it never meant as much then as it does now.

I read articles like this and I think that I must have been reading very intently 'cos my eyes have started watering a bit from keeping them open too long without blinking, but I realise that's not why and it scares me. It scares me that if I can get this upset about a little girl I've never met and likely never would have, what would it be like if my own daughter was hurt by someone. I feel physically ill just thinking about it. How anyone, anywhere could ever do something like that, it just doesn't work, I can't make it make sense. And what's worse is she's not the first, she's just the latest, most public case.

People sicken me and things like this make me wonder if there's any hope for society anymore. It also makes me more determined than ever to shield my family from these kinds of monsters. Nobody will ever harm my family while I draw breath.

[The Edge]

The mother (and the assholes who did this to the poor girl) are all a complete waste of space and oxygen is being wasted on them.

This comment from the mother in this article is absolutely appalling.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4145436a11.html

In a text message to the Star Times yesterday, Lisa Kuka said "My gurl and me r fine." Told that her family believed she had been aware of what was happening to Nia, she responded: "Blieve wot u wnt 2."

[Hurtuso]

A lot of stuff doesn't make it to court. The anti-smacking bill was a rough attempt at aiding kids but I don't think it was handled smartly by Bradford.
Not so long ago it was common to hear the screams of kids & wives as they got the shit smashed out of them behind closed doors. Mainly the poor women, while everyone just turned a blind eye and carried on with their own day to day concerns. We've come a long way but for all our ingenuity this obviously hasn't been solved. I'd put these issues, real human issues, well ahead of animals or the environment for example.

[crocos]

The Anti-smacking bill achieved precisely squat.

Nice sentiment, but frankly those that are going to abuse kids? It makes no difference; they will anyway - abuse was already covered by the Assault laws.

[Redneck]

The bill's stated objective was not to "completely eradicate all abuse from this day forward for the rest of eternity"